HI - Looking for advice

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lotus12
Posts: 7
Joined: June 19th, 2016, 9:35 pm
Location: Staffordshire

HI - Looking for advice

Post: # 13865Post lotus12
June 23rd, 2016, 5:57 am

Hi,

We recently rejected the idea of a motor home and have decided to look for a demountable probably on a Hilux Extra cab for next year. The truck will need to tow a trailer plus car (total wt. 1 ton) with the camper mounted, to reduce the total length of the set up we are thinking of a camper that doesn't overhang the bed. We are considering a pop up type so it can be stored in the garage over the winter. After trawling the net we think a Northstar or GaZell might be suitable.

Hopefully next month we'll start looking around.

My initial concerns are whether the Hilux will cope with the camper plus trailer and what modifications will be required to stiffen the rear suspension. What would the truck be like to drive with the stiffer suspension without the camper?

Also would there be any condensation issues with the top up version?

Any help would be appreciated.

Cheers

Steve & Jenny

.

Mike
Posts: 236
Joined: August 23rd, 2014, 8:36 pm
Location: near Yeovil

Re: HI - Looking for advise

Post: # 13866Post Mike
June 23rd, 2016, 8:06 am

Hi Steve and Jenny welcome to the group,
personally I have no experience of towing but I know others in the group have so I'm sure they will be able to comment, regarding rear suspension the most popular way is to fit air bags there are several about but Marcle Leisure who advertise on the site are good,
I have used them twice now, they are a DIY fit generally. So with a load it's just a matter of adding air and levelling the suspension then when empty letting the air out but just leaving a couple of psi in.
They work well. Also read the buyers guide on here.
BTW this week end we have a get together in Branscombe Devon if you able pop along plenty of people to chat to. RUBBERRAT on here did have a pop top for sale not sure if it still is though. Good luck and don't hesitate to ask questions we all started somewhere and made plenty of mistakes so it's good to talk and share the collective knowledge cheers
Mike and Kaz
2008 Ford Ranger 3.0 Wildtrack
Nomad ( Ranger ) Demountable

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zildjian
Site Admin
Posts: 22061
Joined: September 8th, 2013, 3:30 pm

Re: HI - Looking for advise

Post: # 13868Post zildjian
June 23rd, 2016, 8:26 am

One of our members Gary now imports the GaZel pop up camper into the UK & we've noticed an increasing number of people looking to this lighter weight option.

Condensation just like a tent or caravan, cook or shower/wash then open windows and doors and air,
weight-wise they are generally lighter than a hard side camper obviously but you may want to up-rate rear springs or add an air suspension kit to make it utterly variable and tailor your ride specifically to the extra load.

Towing is usually either extend trailer A-frame or add a towbar extension piece, neither of which may be needed if as you say
the camper doesn't protrude out back past tailgate line.

I believe we have members here with some knowledge of pop-top campers, I know we have at least one for sale here in the UK if you'd like to visit and look over one, and its in Norfolk where Northstar importer is in Lincolnshire
so possibly a round trip too :mrgreen:

If you are in Devon this weekend, many of us are at Branscombe camping (near Seaton)

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Gary W
Posts: 143
Joined: March 19th, 2015, 8:01 pm
Location: Portland, Dorset. UK
Contact:

Re: HI - Looking for advise

Post: # 13872Post Gary W
June 23rd, 2016, 11:02 am

lotus12 wrote:Hi,

We recently rejected the idea of a motor home and have decided to look for a demountable probably on a Hilux Extra cab for next year. The truck will need to tow a trailer plus car (total wt. 1 ton) with the camper mounted, to reduce the total length of the set up we are thinking of a camper that doesn't overhang the bed. We are considering a pop up type so it can be stored in the garage over the winter. After trawling the net we think a Northstar or GaZell might be suitable.

Hopefully next month we'll start looking around.

My initial concerns are whether the Hilux will cope with the camper plus trailer and what modifications will be required to stiffen the rear suspension. What would the truck be like to drive with the stiffer suspension without the camper?

Also would there be any condensation issues with the top up version?

Any help would be appreciated.

Cheers

Steve & Jenny

.
Hi Guys

With a lightweight and well designed demountable (particularly in respect of weight distribution) the HiLux Extra Cab can happily tow up to it's recommended GTW without any concerns. I speak from experience as our own HiLux Extra cab covers around 30,000 km per annum with a demountable (DC-220 type) well over half of which are towing a big trailer. With our DC200/220, Camperhit or Gazell you will have no towing restrictions with Extra Cab base cars, with the Gazell you can even tow a full size trailer with the Double Cab version.

Even with a light camper and even with the HiLux Extra Cab air bags are beneficial and highly recommended. Primary benefits are the ability to level the truck side to side and giving the suspension a little more travel before it runs into the overload spring (after which most of your suspension comes from the tyres and chassis flex). If you're towing of course the above applies only more so. Being able to level the camper for a good night's sleep is another massive plus.
The issue with all stock suspension is that it's a massive compromise. It's not great empty and it's not great loaded. It's ok in the middle but that's not much help to us in the world of demountables! We've been working with Pedders suspension to develop a kit specifically for demountables and what they've come up with is amazing. It's a progressive system so empty the ride is, if anything, slightly better than stock. With the demountable in place though it's in a different league. I never tire of how well the truck drives with this stuff installed. The kit consists of replacement springs, dampers, and if you don't already have them, air bags.
If the budget won't stretch initially don't despair. We have tens of thousands of kms experience towing with a HiLux/demountable and stock suspension (plus air). It's safe and worry free, you're just always aware that the camper is there. With the Pedders kit installed the handling is so good you pretty much forget the camper and it actually tows better with the demountable in place than the stock truck does empty. Come and say hello at Bransombe this weekend or give me a call if you're interested in finding out more.

Image

Image


Best wishes

Gary
Last edited by Gary W on June 23rd, 2016, 12:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

SBS Adventure Campers

Mobile: +44 (0) 7595 368 422
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Toshbins
Posts: 237
Joined: October 22nd, 2015, 12:12 pm
Location: Between Reading and Oxford

Re: HI - Looking for advise

Post: # 13873Post Toshbins
June 23rd, 2016, 11:35 am

Hi Steve and Jenny.
I'm still waiting for new demountable to arrive, but have just finished fitting air suspension. See 'What are you up to' thread for photos etc.
I was worried that it would make the ride harder when unladen, but to be honest I can't tell the difference. Have yet to try it with the camper - but as others have commented - it will make a difference I am sure.

Graham

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Gary W
Posts: 143
Joined: March 19th, 2015, 8:01 pm
Location: Portland, Dorset. UK
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Re: HI - Looking for advise

Post: # 13874Post Gary W
June 23rd, 2016, 11:59 am

lotus12 wrote:Hi,

Also would there be any condensation issues with the top up version?

Any help would be appreciated.

Cheers

Steve & Jenny

.
Hello again

Condensation is often misunderstood. When you breathe you breathe moisture into the air. When that moist air comes into contact with a cold surface it will condense forming water droplets. It can't be completely prevented but it can be managed to such an extent that it is all but eliminated in practical terms.
On the Gazell with canvas roof sides you will not suffer from condensation as the ventilation through the breathable fabric sides is exceptional. If you elect for the insulated roof or add the winter cover to the canvas roof then these are not breathable. Then you will have to manage the ventilation as you would in any solid walled camper. All our campers are engineered to partially manage condensation for you with exceptional insulation and almost anal attention to eliminating thermal bridges. There is well designed and engineered ventilation to allow you to manage the rest. This includes the Gazell. On most Dutch Campers and Camperhit models this attention to detail is well demonstrated by the access door which is also engineered to act as the primary condensing plate. Under circumstances where condensation must form (extremes in temperature and insufficient ventilation) it will always form on the door first where it can be easily managed.

So, either way, no issues :-)

Best wishes

Gary

SBS Adventure Campers

Mobile: +44 (0) 7595 368 422
Desk: +44 (0) 1305 305 900

Web: sbsadventurecampers.com
Web: djangocampers.eu



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lotus12
Posts: 7
Joined: June 19th, 2016, 9:35 pm
Location: Staffordshire

Re: HI - Looking for advise

Post: # 13879Post lotus12
June 23rd, 2016, 11:02 pm

Mike wrote:Hi Steve and Jenny welcome to the group,
personally I have no experience of towing but I know others in the group have so I'm sure they will be able to comment, regarding rear suspension the most popular way is to fit air bags there are several about but Marcle Leisure who advertise on the site are good,
I have used them twice now, they are a DIY fit generally. So with a load it's just a matter of adding air and levelling the suspension then when empty letting the air out but just leaving a couple of psi in.
They work well. Also read the buyers guide on here.
BTW this week end we have a get together in Branscombe Devon if you able pop along plenty of people to chat to. RUBBERRAT on here did have a pop top for sale not sure if it still is though. Good luck and don't hesitate to ask questions we all started somewhere and made plenty of mistakes so it's good to talk and share the collective knowledge cheers
Mike and Kaz
Mike and Kaz,

Thanks for the welcome and useful advise regarding rear suspension. Are there two types of suspension, one with an on-board compressor and another that is pressured by an external pump?

Unfortunately we are away this weekend, otherwise it would have been a great way to meet other members and view their set ups.

Cheers

Steve &Jenny

lotus12
Posts: 7
Joined: June 19th, 2016, 9:35 pm
Location: Staffordshire

Re: HI - Looking for advise

Post: # 13880Post lotus12
June 23rd, 2016, 11:20 pm

zildjian wrote:One of our members Gary now imports the GaZel pop up camper into the UK & we've noticed an increasing number of people looking to this lighter weight option.

Condensation just like a tent or caravan, cook or shower/wash then open windows and doors and air,
weight-wise they are generally lighter than a hard side camper obviously but you may want to up-rate rear springs or add an air suspension kit to make it utterly variable and tailor your ride specifically to the extra load.

Towing is usually either extend trailer A-frame or add a towbar extension piece, neither of which may be needed if as you say
the camper doesn't protrude out back past tailgate line.

I believe we have members here with some knowledge of pop-top campers, I know we have at least one for sale here in the UK if you'd like to visit and look over one, and its in Norfolk where Northstar importer is in Lincolnshire
so possibly a round trip too :mrgreen:

If you are in Devon this weekend, many of us are at Branscombe camping (near Seaton)
Hi Zildjain,

Thanks for the advise, we intend to replace my existing truck and look at many models over the summer. As I said in my last post it's a pity we are away this weekend.

Cheers

Steve & Jenny

lotus12
Posts: 7
Joined: June 19th, 2016, 9:35 pm
Location: Staffordshire

Re: HI - Looking for advise

Post: # 13881Post lotus12
June 23rd, 2016, 11:33 pm

Gary W wrote:
lotus12 wrote:Hi,

We recently rejected the idea of a motor home and have decided to look for a demountable probably on a Hilux Extra cab for next year. The truck will need to tow a trailer plus car (total wt. 1 ton) with the camper mounted, to reduce the total length of the set up we are thinking of a camper that doesn't overhang the bed. We are considering a pop up type so it can be stored in the garage over the winter. After trawling the net we think a Northstar or GaZell might be suitable.

Hopefully next month we'll start looking around.

My initial concerns are whether the Hilux will cope with the camper plus trailer and what modifications will be required to stiffen the rear suspension. What would the truck be like to drive with the stiffer suspension without the camper?

Also would there be any condensation issues with the top up version?

Any help would be appreciated.

Cheers

Steve & Jenny

.
Hi Guys

With a lightweight and well designed demountable (particularly in respect of weight distribution) the HiLux Extra Cab can happily tow up to it's recommended GTW without any concerns. I speak from experience as our own HiLux Extra cab covers around 30,000 km per annum with a demountable (DC-220 type) well over half of which are towing a big trailer. With our DC200/220, Camperhit or Gazell you will have no towing restrictions with Extra Cab base cars, with the Gazell you can even tow a full size trailer with the Double Cab version.

Even with a light camper and even with the HiLux Extra Cab air bags are beneficial and highly recommended. Primary benefits are the ability to level the truck side to side and giving the suspension a little more travel before it runs into the overload spring (after which most of your suspension comes from the tyres and chassis flex). If you're towing of course the above applies only more so. Being able to level the camper for a good night's sleep is another massive plus.
The issue with all stock suspension is that it's a massive compromise. It's not great empty and it's not great loaded. It's ok in the middle but that's not much help to us in the world of demountables! We've been working with Pedders suspension to develop a kit specifically for demountables and what they've come up with is amazing. It's a progressive system so empty the ride is, if anything, slightly better than stock. With the demountable in place though it's in a different league. I never tire of how well the truck drives with this stuff installed. The kit consists of replacement springs, dampers, and if you don't already have them, air bags.
If the budget won't stretch initially don't despair. We have tens of thousands of kms experience towing with a HiLux/demountable and stock suspension (plus air). It's safe and worry free, you're just always aware that the camper is there. With the Pedders kit installed the handling is so good you pretty much forget the camper and it actually tows better with the demountable in place than the stock truck does empty. Come and say hello at Bransombe this weekend or give me a call if you're interested in finding out more.

Image

Image


Best wishes

Gary
Hi Gary,

Thanks very much for the useful information in both of your replies. I will call you when we get back off holiday and arrange a visit to Portland next month.

Cheers

Steve & Jenny

lotus12
Posts: 7
Joined: June 19th, 2016, 9:35 pm
Location: Staffordshire

Re: HI - Looking for advise

Post: # 13882Post lotus12
June 23rd, 2016, 11:50 pm

Toshbins wrote:Hi Steve and Jenny.
I'm still waiting for new demountable to arrive, but have just finished fitting air suspension. See 'What are you up to' thread for photos etc.
I was worried that it would make the ride harder when unladen, but to be honest I can't tell the difference. Have yet to try it with the camper - but as others have commented - it will make a difference I am sure.

Graham
Hi Graham,

Thanks for the response, still learning about the site so please can you advise where the " what are you up to" thread is.

Cheers

Steve & Jenny

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